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  #11  
Old 12-11-2011, 05:23 PM
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It is also for the EPA so your truck doesn't smoke as much when you first start it. That is why it cycles after starting it.
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  #12  
Old 12-11-2011, 08:29 PM
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I should video tape my truck and you'll realize exactly what they do lol. I still haven't got them all hooked in yet and theres been a few 15F mornings... I have to step on the pedal a little to get it to start fast but on a day like that it just tops the pistons off with fuel and when it starts I would bet nobody can see the entire side of the truck.

Not sure how much about the whole speil of things you know but diesels rely on compression, not a spark plug. When you compress something, it gets hot, especially when its compressed as fast as the piston compresses it. Well the fuel shoots in as a fine mist which is so that the fine particles take little time to soak up all that heat, a big particle would get hot on the outsides and soak into the inside taking a lot of time which the piston does not give it time to do that. If it had big particles the engine wouldn't run as efficiently, which is why diesels are moving into the 30,000psi range of injection pressures. So the fuel gets hot, and eventually it gets so hot (around 400F I think), that it just spontaneously ignites. If the injectors are spraying it correctly at the high pressures intended and the compression is good, it should ignite right around TDC. Maybe you have seen that the timing is 10-20* before top dead center (BTDC), which is to allow time for the fuel to get ignited by TDC and then it has the entire stroke to work it's magic, rather than half a stroke or something. Now temperature comes into play when the entire engine block is cold, when the engine block is above 60F it really doesn't matter. What is happening is when you start the truck, it sucks in that freezing winter air, then compresses it and hopefully it can compress it to the point of getting the fuel to that 400F. But how well do you think it would work if the incoming air was 0F, the engine block was 0F, the fuel was 0F.... It just doesn't get as warm as it needs to, especially if cranking RPM is low, which in the winter it usually does crank slower due to more friction from the cold engine (making tolerances tighter), and cold engine oil. To counter this, we give it an advantage by heating up the intake air so that even though the engine temp is 0F and the fuel is 0F, the air will be warm and when compressed will be even warmer, which hopefully at that point the thing has got to a degree high enough to hit the diesels autoignition point (400), which it usually does. You might notice the truck is a little harder to start on that 0F day which is why some people run the grid heaters for 2 cycles, waiting for the "wait to start" light to turn off, then turning the key off and back on and waiting again. The intake manifold (that the grid heater is in) is aluminum, so even though the intake air is hot, aluminum is very good at taking heat and radiating it back to the open air, this is why 2 cycles helps as it gets the air even warmer. The grid heaters will reach 500F after 30 seconds or so, and they will get red hot. The wait to start light takes longer as it gets colder to account for the heat needed to start the engine. You notice above 60F the light goes out instantly since they grid heater is not needed. As I said, I have no grid heaters and am starting the thing at 15F.. The cummins is pretty good at starting in cold temps, but I don't recommend not using the grid heater just because it can. Do as I say not as I do lol.

Hopefully something in there answered your question
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  #13  
Old 12-12-2011, 09:08 AM
Gutterwffw66 Gutterwffw66 is offline
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So this Grid heater is not necessary but makes it easier to start especially during cold weather??? Mine is working sometimes and then other times it doesn't work. But would a faulty GRID HEATER cause the truck to turn over and not start right away??? Somtimes my truck starts right up like it's suppose too and then other times it starts up after turning it over two or three times.

Last edited by Gutterwffw66; 12-12-2011 at 09:15 AM.
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  #14  
Old 12-12-2011, 09:20 AM
Gutterwffw66 Gutterwffw66 is offline
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Thanks MnTOM that makes more sense to me. I didn't see your post at first. Just to be safe i put some Diesel 911 in my tank and some Lucas in there too. I always wait for the start engine light to go off before I start it. But you are right it usually starts after the second or third try. But whats more funny is ever since I put that Diesel 911 in the tank and the Lucas I haven't had that problem.
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  #15  
Old 12-12-2011, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutterwffw66 View Post
So this Grid heater is not necessary but makes it easier to start especially during cold weather??? Mine is working sometimes and then other times it doesn't work. But would a faulty GRID HEATER cause the truck to turn over and not start right away??? Somtimes my truck starts right up like it's suppose too and then other times it starts up after turning it over two or three times.
Yes, the grid heater is not necessary for starting, it makes it easier to start when cold out. You might try plugging in your truck to see if that helps.

It is possible, the engine is trying to heat up the air with compression, yet when the grid heater isn't working properly, it makes it harder on the engine to start. Have you tried turning the truck on without starting it twice, with waiting for the 'Wait to Start' light to go off, before the starting the truck?

You might have a bad connection to your grid heaters. You might need to remove the drivers side battery and check under the battery mount and see if the relay there is corroded or worse. The grid heaters are very simple electrically, they have 1 connection and generally don't go bad.

When you go to start your truck, the grid heaters come on, then go off, when they go off, can you hear a 'thunk' under the hood, drivers side? If so, then you need to find that relay under the battery and see if the wires are corroded, not making good connection or broken. Also, check the terminals of the grid heaters to see if they are loose. The grid heaters use lots of amperage to heat up, so if a connection is loose or missing, you might not be getting the proper amperage to them.
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  #16  
Old 12-12-2011, 05:26 PM
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That diesel 911 is not good for the fuel system at all. It has no lube in it and is only for diesel that is gelled, it is not for general use. You can use a light dose of power service (white bottle) but really the diesel stations usually put antigel in already. It was -10F last year and I never had a problem and that's in Missouri so even down here they put enough antigel in to protect against gelling. The reason it starts better is because diesel 911 is like ether in a bottle. It makes the cetane a lot higher and allows the engine to fire right up. But as I stated, it is NOT good for the fuel system at all. The only way to get high cetane (which makes it start good as you noticed) without compromising lubrication is with biodiesel. That stuff is one of the best forms of fuel when it comes to lubrication, however, it gels at a relatively high point. Stations should account for this though and so you can get B20 that should be good to 0F. Personally, run diesel from a reputable station, don't add any antigel, let it crank another time or 2, and don't worry about it.

As for why it cranks over longer sometimes, I've noticed this as well. I am not sure if yours is a 12V or 24V but mine is a 12V and some days it likes to crank a few more turns for good measure or who knows what. 24V should be consistent with starting.
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  #17  
Old 12-14-2011, 12:42 PM
Gutterwffw66 Gutterwffw66 is offline
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Mine is a 24 Valve. It's not even that cold here. Something is up. I did notice that when i let the fuel pump cycle three times... (By giving the engine a bump, wait till the pump shuts off and bump it another two more times) it starts right up. I do plug it in but only when the temp is 28 Degrees F or lower. And I guess i will not be putting that 911 in there anymore. I didn't know that about that stuff. what about the LUCAS treatment that is good isn't it???

Last edited by Gutterwffw66; 12-14-2011 at 12:46 PM.
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  #18  
Old 12-14-2011, 04:17 PM
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Most of us use 2 stroke oil, it lubes up the system well. You use 1 ounce to 1 gallon, i.e. you fill up with 20 gallons, you put in 20 ounces.
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  #19  
Old 12-14-2011, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutterwffw66 View Post
Mine is a 24 Valve. It's not even that cold here. Something is up. I did notice that when i let the fuel pump cycle three times... (By giving the engine a bump, wait till the pump shuts off and bump it another two more times) it starts right up. I do plug it in but only when the temp is 28 Degrees F or lower. And I guess i will not be putting that 911 in there anymore. I didn't know that about that stuff. what about the LUCAS treatment that is good isn't it???
That sounds like a weak lift pump. Do you happen to know what your fuel pressure is?
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  #20  
Old 12-15-2011, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stodg73 View Post
Most of us use 2 stroke oil, it lubes up the system well. You use 1 ounce to 1 gallon, i.e. you fill up with 20 gallons, you put in 20 ounces.
In my old 24 valve, I would just dump in a quart of Amsoil Intercepter before I fueled up. Usually put 20-25 gallons in when I fueled. I also use Power Service (white bottle) religiously, even still in my 08. My 08 does not require any additional lube due to the truck being designed to run Ultra Low. I like the PS for an Anti-jell. Jelled diesel is NO fun!
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